The IT Skeptic - Comments for "ITIL V3 sample exam question: is it just vague or plain wrong?"

You are totaly right! the

Visitor — Wed, 09 Dec 2009 19:45:15 +0000

You are totaly right! the ITIL exam is more about comprehension of the english language under their terminology. I work in IT. If a customer asks me to order them a desktop bundle, I order a desktop bundle. It's now called a CTI according to ITIL

Thanks for giving me a laugh.

tim — Fri, 21 Aug 2009 05:54:50 +0000

Thanks for giving me a laugh.

Sad but true

JamesFinister — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 11:29:20 +0000

Some of what you say is true, but first of all lets us be clear that what makes a professional isn't just technical skill. When I go to a professional for advice I also expect, as an example, adherence to a clear ethical code - though I might not agree with it myself. If I go to a libel lawyer for advice on a comment made on a forum, for instance, I expect the lawyer to give me impartial advice independent of their own views.

ITIL, incidentally, was not created or promoted by the business, and I suspect the business doesn't currently care less about it. On the other hand the CIO probably does.

Yes I agree the business probably doesn't know what it wants, but part of the ITSM philosophy is that the responsibility for helping them define what they want rests with us. If a client went to an architect and said they wanted rooms 1m tall the architect would be at fault not to point out they couldn't stand up in that space.

No skeptic...

Visitor — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 21:20:41 +0000

IT people are not all as you describe. IT people are professionals with professional acccreditations and often highly trained. ITIL is an effort by the BUSINESS to force IT to conform to their lack of understanding. The reason most projects fail is because of poor definition. IT can attempt to gather requirements from the business, but when one pokes an elephants ass, one gest a pile of shyte. And, don't underestimate me boyo, I'm not even IT, I'd eat you for breakfast without a doubt ;-) Is mise le meas, Demne.

Baseline

Visitor — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 21:10:47 +0000

Baseline assessment would be my move. First thing in improving a system or solution is baseline it's current performance under normal operation. 'Carry out a baseline assessment to understand the current situation' .... then screw a few quid out of them and leave them with dreams of a future where alls rosy - ITIL 101.
'A' cannot be correct even for ITIL cos everyone knows you'll get no sensible useful answers from 'the business', even if you can identify a spineless fcukwit who will represent 'the business'.

highly skilled people

skeptic — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 21:06:25 +0000

"highly skilled people who know what they're doing"? IT skill levels are high only on technical topics - the toys. Process skills are patchy, with lots of low patches. Interpersonal and cultural skills are generally awful. And most of all professionalism is very low - most IT people are like you - closed-minded aggressive cowboys who don't see why they shouldn't be allowed to ride free, who just HATE the ITIL concept of accountability. As a result, IT DON'T know what they are doing, not holistically enough to get the job done. that's why high percentages of changes and projects fail, why services fail (incidents) and why customer dissatisfaction levels are so often high. if IT people knew what they were doing IT would be just another business unit and we wouldn't have all these debates

But the point is

Visitor — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 20:57:37 +0000

if you are going to preach a new doctrine to highly skilled people who know what they're doing, then the least you can do is get your answer straight. ITIL is a pile of shite

Good man

Visitor — Fri, 07 Aug 2009 20:55:29 +0000

Well said. Is mise le meas, Demne.

CSI

print_iq — Tue, 28 Apr 2009 10:29:28 +0000

the answer is B is the right one for the first step of CSI Model is to Carry out a baseline assessment to understand the current situation, cause you have to know where you stand right now agains the baseline the ITIL provide

It's the OODA loop!

Al Maurer — Wed, 28 May 2008 21:34:04 +0000

OK, I've come late to this discussion, having been working with Sample Papers 3 & 4 and new to Sample Paper 6. Thinking ITIL, I would have guessed answer b. In ITIL, all the processes start with figuring out where you are, making a plan, then acting on it.* That immediately narrows it down to a & b--but b is the better answer because it's more inclusive of figuring out where you are. a refers to the business side b is the situation generally.

So I think it's typically tricky but not ambiguous.

* That is a lot like Plan-Do-Check-Act or in Col Boyd's formulation Observe-Orient-Decide-Act. The OODA Loop. :-)

how do such typo's happen?

Liz Gallacher — Thu, 20 Mar 2008 08:37:56 +0000

Firstly - this was not just any typo - a misspelling or such. SURELY you check and double-check the correct answers are given! The same thing happened with the "How to pass your V3 exam book", which lessened the credibility of an otherwise good book.
Equally worrying is the answer given on the itsmfi forum:-

"The examination team responsible for the v3 Foundation papers, both live and sample find it difficult to comment directly on this forum to queries surrounding specific questions, even if they are aware of them.
This is because they are contracted to APMG as the Official Accreditor and the agreed channel for communication of this nature is from the Accreditor, to all of the respective Examination Institutes and then to Training Providers.
The examination team have been aware of the issue regarding this particular question for some time, they have advised APMG and have resolved the issue. They are not responsible for issuing any communications.
However, on this occasion I am happy to advise that the cause of the issue was quite simple. An error was made during the data entry phase, answer 'B' was input whereas it should have been answer 'A' and this was missed during subsequent QA.
This has been corrected and additionally, Option A has been reworded to - Understand the business objectives.
The question is still available as a sample and will appear on Sample Paper 7 which will be issued shortly. At this time, all Training Providers will be advised to retire Sample Paper 6
from use."

So, when mistakes are spotted, they are not communicated properly, and the answer each time is to issue another paper. Am I the only training provider who prints student manuals to include the mock exams - as mine are spiral-bound, that makes changing them rather difficult!
Liz Gallacher
Freelance Trainer and Consultant

Just Plain Wrong !

Alison — Thu, 20 Mar 2008 06:57:09 +0000

Rosemary Gurney was kind enough to respond to this via the itSMFI bulletin board and confirmed a 'typo' that sneaked through QA. It is fixed in sample paper 7. For Rosemarys full comment see http://www.itsmfi-forum.org/view_topic.php?id=307&forum_id=12&jump_to=945#p945

Alison

Lost In Translation...

Alison Adams — Wed, 05 Mar 2008 15:44:43 +0000

D - I agree entirely that Paper 4 Q11 is a completely reasonable question with no ambiguity.
So what on earth went wrong with the amendment in Paper 6 and why didn't anybody notice before it went public ?!
I just had a discussion on this with my class as we used paper 6 as a 'mock' and I have asked them to let me know if the question appears in their real exam - I dont know what to advise them - put the APMG answer or the right answer ?!
I posted this on itSMFI too, hoping for an answer there or to my email to ISEB/APMG.
Still waiting.....

Alison

Simple mistake?

D Wells — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 01:52:18 +0000

It may be that this is just a simple mistake? Interestingly, the identical question appears in Sample paper 4 for the v3 Foundation (Question 11). In this paper the correct answer is also "b". However, we are given slightly different options and "b" reads "Understand the vision of the business".

I always understood this to be an unambiguous (correct) answer, although it appears something has been 'lost in translation' between sample paper 4 and sample paper 6!

By the way, I too have been awaiting a response from ISEB on this particular issue ...

CPE

JamesFinister — Mon, 03 Mar 2008 09:01:50 +0000

We should keep a distinction between a practical experience based component to the inital qualification, and an on going CPE element post qualification. With both, however, there are practical issues to consider. Who, for instance, decides what qualifies as CPE, where do we find people suitably qualified to assess practical work, and how do we deal with the possible mismatch between the whole range of ITIL processes and functions compared to the span of control of an individual candidate.

And how do we stop it becoming another revenue generating self perpetuating aspect of the industry?

Exam driven training

JamesFinister — Mon, 03 Mar 2008 08:50:56 +0000

Brad,

One of the implications of the changes in the way ITIL is examined, which IIRC dates back to the v2 refresh, is a shift in the way the subject is taught. V1 training schemes focussed less on exam technique and practice and more on developing ideas. I know from speaking to some of the early examiners that they often found new insights by reading what students had written. We also took into account a delegates performance on the training course itself. I think this used to attract up to 10% of the marks, and we took the assessment very seriously.

Now it sems the training is more black and white and not aboput development of the individual.

ISACA seperate out technical competence evidenced by exam success from on the job certification by professional peers. Perhaps a way ahead?

The saviour of the investment

buraddo — Mon, 03 Mar 2008 08:19:07 +0000

I posted a comment on the other topic from skep related to this

http://www.itskeptic.org/node/479#comment-2409

Continuous Certification like the PMP model will help to prolong the life of the certification and stem to rot created by commodotizing the system. It create the ability to extend the brand to other partners and products which make people continually invest in the model. And the reason I know why the lord of ITIL are thinking on this, is it could double, triple or even quadruple the revenue per customer they have now..

Brad Vaughan
blogs.sun.com/buraddo

PiMP your ITIL Cert :)

buraddo — Mon, 03 Mar 2008 08:13:23 +0000

I still think the continuous certification model used by PMP and others (even in different industries) falls short is that it is only requiring more book based learning or in most cases just attendance. It is really just measuring interest and commitment, not capability..

Brad Vaughan
blogs.sun.com/buraddo

professional certification as an annually renewed status

skeptic — Mon, 03 Mar 2008 07:33:00 +0000

Agree with Jim: the model of professional certification as an annually renewed status administered by a governing body who track ongoing professional development and behaviour becoming a registered professional is the way to go. It is also light-years ahead of the capability or intent of OGC, APMG or itSMF. IOSM tried but muffed it. I said on ITSM Watch

There was nothing until recently that provided certification and college for practicing [ITIL] professionals. Now we have the Institute of Service Management in the U.K. and the newly formed Institute of Certified Service Managers, or the IT Service Management Institute in U.S.

Do any of these have the official recognition of OGC? What governance does it provide over their activities or standards? Why is the ICSM-USA only for ITIL “masters” but the U.K. body more broadly for “senior ITIL-ers”? Because nobody is internationally regulating the emergence of these bodies.

and in another article

We [in IT] still have a long way to go to meet the levels of best practice set by other industries. A professional is measured by three attributes: their attitude, development and ability...There needs to be international standards of tertiary qualification, and very different courses offered by the universities. There needs to be international networks of accreditation. Most of all there must be much higher expectations set of the people we entrust with these huge projects.

Its not all about Multi-guess

buraddo — Mon, 03 Mar 2008 03:48:45 +0000

So I will take back what I said about the Brit education system. It is my cultural birth right as an Aussie to heckle the mother land as much as possible. They are only complicit in developing the modern mass education system.

Ignorant controversial ramblings follow

"The French (inventing the university) and the Italians (via the Roman Catholic Church, inventing multi level schooling) are as much to blame. Before these things, education was more of an apprenticeship, with scholars, artists and professionals able to show a direct genealogy to there mentors. Your skill was given credibility through who you worked with and the exposure they gave you to success. I don't care whether the V3 exams have British or Dutch influence. Paper based education and exam based certification is just a poor instrument for creating capability."

I am not sure if multi-guess is necessarily the problem. Its a tool to measure content knowledge and if done properly, can be good as any other. But capability is X parts knowledge & Y parts skill & Z parts experience. Its true that the cost of marking the exams is almost eliminated through the use of multi-guess.

I think it is right to say that the whole concept of exam based certification is driven by a financial motive. Having a certification scheme is a known method for improving adoption of any framework. Companies are always looking for ways to try and quantify the skill of staff.

There is nothing about the way the certification scheme measures success that can reinforce the goal they state for the certification. They make no attempt to measure if the courses work (I think skep you made the commment about feedback). So growth, adoption and revenue can be the only measure, and therefore motive.

Brad Vaughan
blogs.sun.com/buraddo